Etching is used to make circuit boards, where a thin copper sheet is selectively dissolved away to form a path for electricity. I love watching Ilya's work. Whats the proper technique for etching Damascus. The only bad experience is the one from which you learn nothing. It won't hurt glass or plastic, but the fumeswill eat a metal lid. It is the ideal acid etch alternative. The key is to have the knife sanded and finished properly, then etch, then neutralize, then only VERY lightly sand it just enough and stop. Damasteel is a powdered metallurgy stainless damascus steel. Never use tap water, spring water, or filtered water - all will cause problems etc. Dunk it in the acetone again then allow to dry. The best quality Damascus does not end. Fast-acting formula, safely use on interior and exterior applications. It is commonly used to etch steel and stainless steel parts, but it is also capable of etching copper. For example, steel can be etched with hydrochloric acid, nitric acid, or sulfuric acid. Then on the last etch , take it out, neutralize the acid without touching the blade, rinse with cold sater, dry the blade with compressed air (I use dust off) and oil . Pour the solution into your watering can you will reduce any splashing using the sprinkle nozzle and the solution will be spread evenly. 157K subscribers in the chefknives community. For Sale: Custom & Semi Production Knives (Dealer), KnifeMaker's Market: Knives & More for Sale, Wanted: Knifemaker / Craftsman / Related Services, Busse / Swamprat / Scrapyard Knives For Sale, For Sale: Traditionals, Slipjoints, "Old Timey", International (Non-US) For Sale & Trade Forums. Muriatic acid; Baking soda for neutralizing the acid; pH test strips . Do not change before creativity! Cleaning the concrete surface with Muriatic Acid is how to Etch Concrete. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly; who errs and comes short again and again; because there is not effort without error and shortcomings; but who does actually strive to do the deed; who knows the great enthusiasm, the great devotion, who spends himself in a worthy cause, who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement and who at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly." hey guys, i used the lovely search function with pretty much no results. There are lots of ways and if they work they are correct. Acid is generally mixed at a ratio of 3 parts water to 1 part acid for sufficient strength to etch properly. How long does ferric chloride take to etch? Then etch it to make the pattern visible. ( 3 years ago In the video linked above, YouTuber TheSmokinApe acid-etches an ESEE blade with Frenchs mustard. Then I remembered I'd been thinking of switching to re-usable etchant, created on the bench using muriatic acid (the store name for hydrochloric acid, HCl, used for cleaning swimming pools). It is a straightforward process, which is used to enhance the appearance of the blade and bring the inherent pattern, lying in wait within the steel, to life. Once you're all ready, you're ready to pick up! on Step 8. Is it just lots of jelly rolls mushed together? The acid etching will need to be done outside or in a well-ventilated area, and you should wear rubber gloves and goggles from here on out. 90% lower fumes than standard Muriatic Acid. Muriatic acid quickly dissolves efflorescence from concrete surfaces, and it removes other stains as well. Either will etch any high carbon steel, eventually. Possible acids include muriatic (hydrochloric) acid (HCL), nitric acid (HNO3), or . I did a simple twist as I like the way it looks. JavaScript is disabled. Hose down or dampen the entire area. It is. Etch in Muriatic Acid from the local hardware store. My problem here is that I've had some really inconsistent results with the vinegar. ethanknott, Ferric chloride is one of the most widely used etchants in the field of chemical etching. The knife in the photo had 3 ten minute dips. Any help would be greatly appreciated thanks guys. Start very dilute, like 1:10 or 1:20. Ferric Chloride is an iron "salt" of HCl that is nonetheless very acidic, though not as "strong" as HCl. To the iron add 100mL of water and 100mL of 12M hydrochloric acid. The impurities give muriatic acid a yellowish . Wash thoroughly your piece of liquor and view it with pure oils. The one thing you DO NOT want when etching Damascus is "fast"..that always equals a poor etch. I've been there before.. We are exploring additional options of engraving and will let you know when those are available. It can also be used to remove soot from firebricks. Ecommerce Site by NeONBRAND. Swishing the steel around in the etch to break up the bubbles is not a bad idea either. Most people use it cold, which is very slow. If not, dip it in the acetone (see lovely photo) then repeat the previous step until you're happy. Never put acid on the microwave! Once you have gathered all the necessary supplies and safety gear, you will be ready to begin etching your garage floor. It doesn't matter as long as the steel is as oil and wax free as it can be. Ferric chloride is very popular. Sure, you can etch steel with hydrochloric acid; e.g. If too late.no problem that is how we learn. Damascus Etching Is Completed With Ferric Chloride or Muriatic Acid Meet your sellers . Damascus's iron is highly respected by its patterns like waves. The nice folks at Forseti have their own quality assurance system in place, and they design many of the more interesting knives in their catalog. American Bladesmith Society bladesmiths represent the cutting edge of forged blade performance and design on six continents. ", Damascus's sleeves, guns, and other metallic pieces become more popular as artists and regain their art. Neutralize the acid and Lightly sand the oxides off with scotch bright or 2000/3000 grit sand paper and re etch (don't touch it with your fingers). Edit* I just realized folks already gave this answer. My question at the moment is, will hot vinegar ruin the temper on a knife? How do you prepare ferric chloride solution for etching? Many hand-forged Damascus blades are made out of high carbon steel with small amounts of chromium in the alloy. Can you use coffee to etch Damascus? It may not display this or other websites correctly. Once it's clean put on your gloves and do not touch it with your bare hands until the whole process is complete. Ferric and Muriatic Acids work on Damascus Steels but will give 2 drastically different results. It's often used in swimming pools to lower the pH of the water. Toch in Damascus, it should be completely clean. I should mention that this should be done outside since the vapors are stinky and it produces hydrogen gas. Ferric chloride is dissolved in water. Thank you Kevin. Can you etch Damascus steel with muriatic acid? Share Save Helvetica Comment CaiLei 3 years ago Follow It is an ultra high carbon steel that achieved liquid state which should, theoretically, allow you to get a homogeneous steel product with equal carbon distribution and no slag inclusions at all. You can also make it, by adding Fe to HCl. Making stuff, hunting, rock climbing, philosophy, general adventure seeker. As with all chemicals, make sure you are wearing the appropriate protective clothing and gear. File away any burrs on the side of the steel you plan to etch with acid. 3:1, 4:1, or 5:1 distilled water to the FeCl are all commonly used dilutions. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Nitric Acid - mixture of 5 - 10% nitric acid with the balance being alcohol. There are two ways (at least) to do Raindrop that are much easier than doing a mosaic of jellyroll, one for use with a hydraulic press and one for use if you don't have a press. Did you make this project? I assume I need to set the oxides but can I still do that weeks later? I don't know if you need a specific concentration of ferric chloride for etching, but I can explain how to make any concentration of ferric chloride as well. RadioShack carries pcb enchant, aka ferric chloride. For ferric acid, keep the grit between 400 and 600. Earn the Windex deep deep hole so that you can fully fill your Dutch item. With ferric acid, keep grit between 400 and 600. Don't use a metal container acid can corrode many metals, leading to the possible destruction of the container. Earn the Windex deep deep hole so that you can fully fill your Dutch item. Read entire label prior to use or storage. Ferric and Muriatic Acids work on Damascus Steels but will give 2 drastically different results. Etching a stainless damascus steel knife (or any damascus) is not as complicated as many people tend to believe. Acid etching a concrete floor is typically a 6-step process: Prepare, clean, and degrease concrete. It's not the only way. [woocommerce-reset-password-nonce] => Pour 1 part acid into 10 parts water to make an acid solution. Do this process a few times. Muratic acid is really not the stuff to use for etching especially inside your house or workshop. https://www.amazon.com/MG-Chemicals-Ferric-Chloride-Liquid/dp/B008UH3SAE/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1492289092&sr=8-1&keywords=ferric+chloride. Every time Hi all, I just completed a dagger, but after I was done RE: New Bladesmith Skill Development And Evaluation. Choose the acid you want to etch the steel with. What Is ChatGPT? Muriatic acid needs no dilution. FORGE, Jan 1, 2014 #4 Icho- Staff Member Likes Received: 154 Trophy Points: 63 Thanks Forge. If you etch before heat treating you'll just erase it in the cleanup sanding. Wet down the surface to be cleaned, using a sponge or a sprayer and allow the acid . placeholder="Leave a comment" onpropertychange="this.style.height=this.scrollHeight + 'px'" oninput="this.style.height=this.scrollHeight + 'px'">. has no defect, one of the components inside the steel is not affected by etching, which makes it unacceptable Damascus to be a unique discovery when it's over. Follow Each Damascus Steel ring is uniqueno two designs will look exactly alike. Makes the material look like carbon steel Damascus. What follows is a step-by-step tutorial on how to acid etch concrete with muriatic acid. Muriatic acid is a powerful and corrosive acidic liquid made from hydrochloric acid, water, and other trace minerals. Put the holes on both sides or you'll get a bar with raindrop on one side and random on the other. How do I heat-treat 440C/CPM-154 Damascus billet? The keys are "pretty dilute" and "multiple, short immersions". -- Theodore Roosevelthttp://stephensforge.com. I have noticed that Muriatic will produce a much shinier surface than Ferric, without a lot of the black that you would expect. Add your Damascus clip to an acoustic container so that it can be released freely and not touch the sides or bottom of the container. Collectors should ensure to keep their blades clean and dry to avoid rust or staining. It is a common mistake that when you work with Damascus, the risk of extinction - the layers of separation - is just what you should do. Suspend your piece in the acid. Once you find that perfect constant companion, that you keep in your pocket or bag, a great way to set it apart, to personalize it, is with laser engraving! Do not change before creativity! Make sure your remaining distilled water does not last longer than a year. Step 1: What You Need Some damascus steel Etchant - Ferric Chloride (strength 42 baume) Distilled water Acetone Glass or plastic containers Extra fine (000) steel wool Wire (to hang piece in acid) Bucket of water Rubber gloves Baking soda oil (I used olive oil as the knife will be used on food) Ask Question Comment Step 2: Clean It's easy! Keep it submerged for 10 to 15 minutes. Muriatic acid is also less potent because it's diluted with water (usually around 31.5 percent HCl) and contains impurities like iron. No matter how effective it is. You will also need to wash a baking bar. Ferric chloride is a common acid used for etching Damascus steel. For example: "You can also use Windex with this step, but do not try to break your piece. Answer Of course, it is possible for any smith to have an improper batch, but any frequency of Damascu, Damascus1 creates the best products in America made of Damascus steel. You don't need a lot. Muriatic Acid, Ferric Chloride, Radio Shack PCB Etchant (Computer board etching solution) and I have he. The When it comes to finish work, addition of the muriatic acid keeps Berthelot recommends sanding the copper from looking blurry, and to at least a clean 600 grit prior to keeps the material out of the solu-etching. No neutralizing step after etching. Muriatic Acid will give a mirror/frosted finish on a polished finish and a lighter grey/grey pattern on a matte finish. Use ferric chloride it is much safer and not as corrosive. STEP 1: STARTING Bring your Damascus at the end of grit 400 to 600. ), Copyright 2012 - 2020 American Bladesmith Society | All Rights Reserved, Bill Moran School of Bladesmithing at Texarkana College. Bubbling air through it hastens the re-oxidation. This is how I do it and it works for me. And that's why we use it!http://damasteel.se/ Could have probably pypassed this step: dumped 1/2 gallon of phosphoric in the tank and sloshed it around with the cap shut and stoppers in. Before you begin, check the expiration date on your acid of choice to be sure that it's not too old. Warm your acid to room temperature. I degrease with multiple wipes of acetone on new paper towels each time, but some guys prefer dish soap and water or alcohol. Dilution should best be done with distilled water to keep it uncontaminated with water minerals. Etching. Wanted to compare it with the home-recipe batch I made. my sword tanks tend to always be in flux, i end up adding peroxide distilled water, or fresh ferric to get then to etch nicely another question is my shop is in garage , it gets cold here will ferric acid freeze , dont want it bursting pvc pipe? We've made your buy experience less painful. Our first Etching Damasteel video:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=inzrn7kL-2UHere is more information about Damasteel and where to order it from. This is commonly sold in home improvement stores and pool supply stores in gallon jugs. Furthermore if forged in the correct manner you can make swords from it that depicts a pattern often likened to watered silk. For most projects and uses, though, its plenty strong and durable. Question You can do this by first mixing a small solution in your watering can starting at a 5:1 ratio. Yet another reason to prefer ferric chloride. Go MINIMUM of 3-1 dilution with DISTILLED water only. Be sure to always wear the appropriate protective gear when you're working with acid. Let your piece remain in acids for 10 to 15 minutes. Cleaning and Etching Concrete It easily dissolves the efflorescence on the concrete surface and removes other stains as well. Etching of Damascus is done after manufacturing or grinding of the blank to bring out the contrasting steel patterns. I'm not going to cover how to make damascus steel, there's lots of information online and it's pretty simple. The hardware store wasn't going to be very helpful in the middle of the night and I was about to put it all off to the next day when I realized I didn't actually care about how the etching was done . on Step 8. I've heard lots of different solution strengths, but 3 parts distilled water to 1 part fecl has worked well for me. Complete etches in a well ventilated space and wear gloves, eye protection, and an apron or old clothes. A standard strength for a careful etch on copper is 42 baume, above this and the ferric will etch more slowly as the solution is viscous. (Add the acid to the water, not water to acid, for safety reasons.) Powered by Invision Community, good movies, good books, smithing, leatherworking, woodworking, guitar. If you have hidden part of your bacteria so that it does not keep, and you want to do some part of acids and baking soda, completely remove the mask, clean the blade, and then use your mask before the second etch. Your email address will not be published. Pour the mixture into a plastic garden watering can. I etch pretty deeply (3-4 soaks at 15-20 minutes, scrubbing oxides off between soaks) then a light buffing with pink scratchless rouge to bring out the contrast. In your well-ventilated area, mix together one part muriatic acid to two parts hydrogen peroxide in a container thats big enough to fit the whole blade. Cheers Johnno Any form of agitation not only helps the etch to even out, it also helps the acid work faster by removing oxides from the surface of the steel. When someone feels their ferric chloride batch has "gone bad", you can add a tablespoon or so of muriatic acid and regenerate it. Uses of Muriatic acid 1. Copper can be etched with ferric chloride mixed in water to form weak hydrochloric acid. These chemical compound work faster than acids. Thoughts? Clorox wipes and Windex work well for cleaning. We have Added Apple Pay, Google Pay & Facebook Pay to our check out. Always pour acid into water. I frequently etch damascus with ferric chloride. Will this stuff like sit in a jar without eating the jar? Ideally you want to test the strength needed first before doing the entire floor. The "active ingredient" in ferric chloride solution is hydrochloric acid. How do I heat-treat my stainless Damascus after purchase? and I did neutralize with baking soda bath as directed. So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. But in Vegas Forge, they give that and more. Before you start, check out the expiry date for your choice of acid to make sure it's too old. That is why I recommended you dilute the HCl way down with water, Michael. You can repeat 5 and 6 steps for a deep etch if you wish. It will corrode everything in sight and do a number on your lungs. What products are often used? What kind of acid do you use to etch a knife? https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCdJMFMqnbLYqv965xd64vYg, https://www.etsy.com/shop/JStatesBladesmith. You can use some 2000 grit sandpaper at this stage to very lightly sand it to bring out the shine on the shiny steel. In this video we show our new and improved process on how to etch the steel after heat treat to bring out that beautiful pattern. The higher the dilution of the ferric, the slower it will etch, and the better/clean the etch will come out within reason. Sorry for the repeat. It's used to etch printed circuit boards. Learn More, click here. [woocommerce-edit-address-nonce] => Very carefully pour your acid in, being sure not to cause any spills or splashes. Some manufacturers like to roll and cut the pieces into the WD-40 to get the darkest difference. I've done several tests, using the same pieces of steel, same amount if vinegar at the same temp, etc, and nothing is working as well as the first batch. Shop Talk - BladeSmith Questions and Answers. Once your Damascus is sanded to the correct grit, thoroughly wash it with alcohol and pat dry with a clean rag. The worst thing about Muriatic acid is storing two gallons of it without eating up every piece of steel in the shop. I don't think I'd ever do this, but, dang, I found the whole instructable fascinating. Like is itmore effective on a piece ground to 120, than one polished to 1000? Thanks for the tips. Tom, diluting muriatic doesn't make ferric chloride, no. Dissolve enough iron in ityes. If you are having trouble getting Ferric, try using Muriatic. Congratulations on your progress. If you use muriatic acid, you can bring Damascus up to 1200 grit, or you can leave it 400 grit. 2 years ago As etching can only work on evenly damp surfaces, you should etch the surface in sections to prevent dry spots. Make sure the blade is clean and free of oil and grease before continuing. It is the readers responsibility to seek out qualified instruction and to research all the health and safety risks involved and take the proper precautions associated with this activity. Mix two-parts of diluted hydrogen peroxide with one-part muriatic acid. Etching is done by exposing the cleaned and polished specimen surface to suitable etching solution such as those described in Table 1. Rinsed the inside of the tank thoroughly with water, then sloshed some baking soda and water inside the tank to neutralize any remaining acid, drained and rinsed again. Asiatic Muriatic does not require dilution. Or is there more of a process? Apply it to a small area of wet concrete. Add clean, clear water to a plastic bucket. Ferric Acid will result in a double grey pattern (dark and light grey pattern) on either a matte or polished finish. My first round of etching went very well, good contrasting colors and an even etch, but since then my etches have been splotchy with very little contrast. Box 71092Springfield, OR 97475. This is a quick guide as to how I etch my damascus steel. Hang your Damascus piece in the warm acid so that it hangs freely and doesnt touch the sides or bottom of the container. Weapons made from Damascus steel are vastly superior to weapons formed from iron! Other, safer products are available for etching concrete and should be used . Beyond that it's a matter of experimentation. No need to go full strength to get results. Vinegar is a pretty weak etch and it helps to use it hot. Make Ferric Chloride (for etching printed circuit boards). Blotchiness in an etch is usually the result of oil somewhere in the system, either on the blade or in the etchant. Use a sprayer or watering container to distribute the acid, scrubbing in as needed. For example, you would use 1 cup of the acid to mix with 2 cups of the peroxide. [woocommerce-login-nonce] => It is a matter of strength and timing. Eliminates the need to use harsh chemicals, provides a safer work enviornment . Fill a glass jar with enough ferric chloride to cover the metal part. Hydrochloric acid has a normal pH of 1.5 to 3.5, while muriatic acid has a pH of about 1 to 2. Bought some muriatic acid and hydrogen peroxide, did a mix of 1 muriatic to 2 hydrogen p. Works great, happy with it, now what do i do with it? [save-account-details-nonce] => Possible acids include muriatic (hydrochloric) acid (HCL), nitric acid (HNO3), or sulfuric acid (H2SO4). View all products of Market Price & Insight. Certain non-acids that form acid in water, such as ferric chloride (FeCl3) or copper sulfate (CuSO4), can also be used as etching chemicals. I dont own any Damascus and this is my first, so is that normal? 03-25-2007, 09:56 PM. In other words, it is a mixture of ferric and cupric chlorides that is renewable effectively forever. Once the half hour is up, check the etching to make sure you're happy with the result. Then you can either just let the solution be open to air for a few days or add a bit of the hydrogen peroxide and boom, ferric chloride. As soon as you're done, oil it. It fumes a lot (toxic) and the fumes will rust everything in your shop. This is commonly sold in home improvement stores and pool supply stores in gallon jugs. . Hardened and tempered steel etches with much more contrast. Muriatic acid is "hydrochloric acid" (HCl) in a less pure and diluted strength for non-technical applications like cleaning bricks. For this reason, true Damascus steel is called wootz Damascus steel to distinguish it from imitations. bladesmithsforum.com So I'm lightin' out for the territory, ahead of the scared and the weak and the mean spirited, because Aunt Sally is fixin to adopt me and civilize me, and I can't stand it. How To Acid Etch Metal With Vinegar The Art Of Weapons. ), but here's my thoughts: The acid only reaches the surface, so it's natural that the pattern will sand off. Dilute by adding 1 part of Muriatic acid to 10 parts of water or 1 cup of acid per liter. A short emersion (2-3 minutes) in diluted ferric chloride will show the pattern without etching too deep. Mix baking soda with distilled water, using a lot of cooking soda so you can dip your piece to reduce acids and stop acne action. If you use muriatic acid, you can bring Damascus up to 1200 grit, or you can leave it 400 grit. Be extra careful at this stage not to touch it! Large Damascus is made of high quality, and the construction process carefully guides no voids, cracks, or hazardous expulsions while working with metal. Posts: 199. There you are, done! Using a broom, scrub the concrete with the acid solution. In Las Vegas Nevada, these workers learned their skills from the master himself, Rob Thomas before leaving the field. Though there was a demand for Damascus steel, in the 19th century it stopped being made. Very clean. Damascus etching is completed with either ferric chloride or muriatic acid. Mixing is a hazardous process (add acid to the peroxide, not the other way around!) I've been there before.. Makes the material look like carbon steel Damascus. The liquid kind needs to be cut with four times as much water as there is ferric, the dry kind you just add five times more water than the instructions call far. wow sounds like fun. Before you begin, check the expiration date on your acid of choice to be sure that it's not too old. Even a single fingerprint will effect your acid etch, so be cautious. i can't wait to mess with it. Tweet. As many Damascus wars come from the market, consumers and new consumers in this matter want to know: Damascus is a solid iron? Muriatic acid is diluted hydrochloric acid; it should be handled with extreme care. You can also use it to clean soot from fireplace bricks. You can also make it, by adding Fe to HCl. This steel had been produced for 11 centuries, and in just about a generation, the means of its manufacture was entirely lost. Each time acid is added, it will eat away at the travertine. The etching solution is made by adding 1 part Muriatic Acid (the common kind that's sold in hardware stores, about $5.00 gal.) Clean the blade. The best thing about Muriatic acid is that it comes in a two gallon box for about $7 at Home Depot.
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